This page may be out of date. Submit any pending changes before refreshing this page.
Hide this message.
Quora uses cookies to improve your experience. Read more
18 Answers
Boris Polania
Boris Polania, Behavioral answers
After reading all the answers in detail, especially Mr. Nick Huber answer, I'd have to disagree in some aspects.

Even though the De Vany and Walls includes the "What we did do was to test directly the impact of pirate supply on the rate at which the movie’s theatrical revenues declined during the course of its run" disclaimer, their data only suggest what is a predictable and logical behavior -pirate copies are more demanded during the first weeks after the release- but it doesn't provide direct evidence of the share of the ticket sales at the box-office that were actually prevented by an illegal sale, certainly a portion did, but assuming a 100% is statistically incorrect, therefore the $40 billion of lost revenue is, at least, debatable.

Even though piracy has increased over the last 20 years, there's no clear way to show how it was really affected the box-office. From 2005 to 2009  North American box-office receipts rose by 20% and 2009 global box-office revenues increased by 7.6% (The Economist "The box office strikes back", May 2010). On the other hand American box-office receipts rose an average of 5.3% every year from 1992 to 2000 (Gary Susman, The Guardian, Friday 31 August 2001), i.e. in 2009 Box Office growth was 2.3% higher than the 1992-2000 average, therefore box-office growth seems to be unaffected by increased piracy rates.

These numbers show that piracy haven't decreased box-office incomes in the last 20 years, it hasn't even managed to slow growth. Overall performance in 2009 was better than in 1992 where piracy was significantly less common.
Nick Huber
Nick Huber, Thinker, writer, data man
Fundamentally, this is an empirical question. There's only one paper in the literature that I could find that collects the dataset that has both movie performance and piracy metrics that is necessary to rigorously answer this question with any degree of confidence.

Arthur De Vany, Professor of economics at University of California, Irvine, and David Walls, Professor of economics at the University of Calgary, have written extensively about this question. (1, 2)

In “Estimating the Effects of Movie Piracy on Box-office Revenue," they note that predicting movie revenues is notoriously difficult, or what they call the "nobody knows principle.” (2, 3) They argue it’s unadvisable to merely subtract what a movie made from an estimate of what it “could have made” without piracy.

With this in mind, empirical claims on the effects of piracy should be aware of the difficult methodological environment in which they are made.

In particular, the empirical difficulty in answering this question is that piracy affects the supply of a movie, but also might affect demand so its overall effect on producer revenue is theoretically ambiguous.

However, the work of Professors Rafeal Rob and Joel Waldfogel, both at the University of Pennsylvania, seems to indicate that piracy actually reduces paid movie demand in a study designed to measure the impact of being shown free content on undergraduate's paid movie consumption: (4)

Employing a variety of cross-sectional and longitudinal empirical approaches, we find large and statistically significant evidence of displacement...These estimates indicate that unpaid consumption, which makes up 5.2% of movie viewing in our sample, reduced paid consumption in our sample by 3.5%. (emphasis mine)

  • For my analysis, I will assume that piracy both increases supply and reduces demand, therefore it unambiguously hurts producer revenue.

Two primary sources of the film industry revenue are DVD sales and box office sales, which may be affected by piracy differently.

First, does piracy affect DVD sales?

Professors Michael Smith and Rahul Telang, both at Carnegie Mellon University, measured the effects of a network broadcast of a movie on DVD sales: (5)

With respect to the impact of movie broadcasts on sales, we find that movie broadcasts on over-the-air networks result in an increase in DVD sales at Amazon.com by an average of 118% in the week after over-the-air broadcast.

However,

With respect to the impact of piracy on sales, we use the television broadcast as an exogenous demand shock and find that the availability of pirated content at the time of broadcast has no effect on post-broadcast DVD sales gains.

  • That is, piracy doesn’t seem to be affecting the film industry – positively or negatively – through DVD sales.

Second, does piracy affect box office sales?

In 2005, the Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA) argued that they were losing $3 billion in box office sales due to piracy. In an industry that takes in less than $10 billion annually, this is a significant claim and, if true, a major concern. (2)

De Vany and Walls use data on one movie’s 14 weeks of box office revenue and associated online piracy activity ("including eDonkey 2000, BitTorrent, Gnutella, FastTrack, Hotline, FTP, Usenet and Internet Relay Chat") during that period to develop a statistical method that is immune to the “nobody knows principle.” (2, 6) In their words,

We did not have to pose the counterfactual conjecture asking what the movie might have earned but for piracy. Nor did we need to speculate as to how many viewers of the pirated version might have gone to see the legitimate version in a theater. What we did do was to test directly the impact of pirate supply on the rate at which the movie’s theatrical revenues declined during the course of its run.

Their data shows that the availability of pirated copies are meaningfully similar to the availability of paid copies in terms of magnitude and time (i.e. it's both easier to find a movie online and offline on opening weekend).

They fit a regression to estimate the changes in box office revenue based changes in movie supply and sum the weekly effects driven by the availability of pirated versions of the movie. For the single movie on which they had data, they estimate that piracy directly destroyed $40 million in box office revenue. Overall, the film grossed approximately $61 million or around $600/pirate source. (7)

  • Assuming that De Vany and Wall’s data is representative of a typical movie with typical levels of piracy which seems reasonable to me, it’s possible that 40% of box office revenue of a typical film is being lost to piracy.

Conclusion

If the film industry takes in roughly $10 billion per year in box office sales, we could estimate that piracy costs the film industry $3-4 billion annually, which is a range constructed from both academic and MPAA research. The primary mechanism of this lost revenue is through box office sales rather than DVD sales.

---
  1. De Vany and Wall's papers on Hollywood are available at http://pareto.ucalgary.ca/hollyw...
  2. De Vany and Walls, “Estimating the Effects of Movie Piracy on Box-office Revenue,” August 24, 2007.
  3. Screenwriter William Goldman is generally quoted as the origin of this idea: “[P]roducers and executives know a great deal about what has succeeded commercially in the past and constantly seek to extrapolate that knowledge to new projects. But their ability to predict at an early stage the commercial success of a new film project is almost nonexistent.”
  4. Rob and Waldfogel, “Piracy on the Silver Screen,” Journal of Industrial Economics, Vol. 55, No. 3.
  5. Smith and Telang, “Competing with free: The impact of movie broadcasts on DVD sales and Internet policy,” MIS Quarterly. June 2009.
  6. Their specification had an R-squared, or rough overall predictive ability, of .78, or 78%.
  7. The total gross of the movie is not directly shown in their paper; however, in their summary statistics (Table 3) they have 13 observations of changes in weekly movie revenue with a mean of -4.7 million. Using the statistical identity of mean, the total movie gross is simply 13 * 4.7 million, or approximately $61 million.
Brian Dunlap
Brian Dunlap, I work on a series of tubes.
I'll qualify (as a disclaimer) what I'm throwing out here with the acknowledgement that these factors are hard to measure, and that a fair amount of my work day is spent serving as, or on behalf of, plaintiffs in civil cases involving online piracy.  So, I'm admittedly biased here. 

Having said that, it's important to keep in mind several factors when attempting to gauge the costs of internet piracy to producers and copyright holders.

  • Direct Impact.  How many people - and how much money - is being diverted from the legitimate source of the material?  How many people forego, entirely, purchasing legitimate DVDs, going to the theatre, purchasing legitimate digital copies (via iTunes, for instance) or subscribing to legitimate digital outlets (such as Netflix) because they occasionally or habitually pirate the material online?  Countless legitimate providers may be missing out on revenue because of the unauthorized distribution of copyrighted material.  As Nick Huber laid out quite well in his excellent answer, some estimates exist but it's hard to nail down precise figures.  This is usually the factor looked at most when attempting to calculate damages and costs.  It's far form the only factor that should be considered, however.
  • Disrupting the Distribution Channels.  These illegitimate sources cut in to what we can call "traffic equity" - eliminating legitimate sources' control over the distribution of their works; becoming the default source of such material in the eyes of countless potential customers; diverting potential customers for not only the individual works in question, but subsequent, previous, ancillary, supplemental product.  The demand for the product exists, so the producer can't be faulted for creating something no one wants.  Rather, their means of generating revenues off of a product that is in demand, is being consumed, is sought after and presumably appreciated by many has been damaged.  So, the product itself isn't all that's been taken from the copyright owner.  Access to the consumer has been taken.
  • Responsive Costs.  How much must now be spent to protect material, either with technology or legal assets after the fact?  How has piracy altered a copyright owner's usual standards and practices?  What are their legal costs, or are they employing countless individuals to seek out the material online and attempt to get it taken down through Digital Millenium Copyright Act (DMCA) complaints?  How much do they now have to spend on security and enforcement?  Certainly, some of the changes copyright owners have implemented - be they technological, or in the form of changes to their usual business practices and habits - might be good things; companies have had no choice but to evolve and we've seen new products and services come about as a result.  But I don't believe companies should be forced to evolve by the illegal acts of others.
  • Perceived Value of Product.  Piracy cuts in to the real, and perceived, value of intellectual property.  So easily able to access the material through piracy, illegitimately, individuals end up perceiving it as being less valuable than it is.  Movie tickets are now seen as too expensive, DVDs just too pricey, legitimate downloads and subscriptions simply not worth the cost in their eyes.  The perceived value of the product continues to drop, and you can't help but wonder just how low it will go.  After all, how valuable could it be when it is so freely available online?  The idea spreads that intellectual property has no real value, or very little value at most, and all of a sudden every single legitimate source of the material - from the theatre to NetFlix - is simply too expensive and a total rip-off.  We're all familiar with the laws of supply and demand, and if there is a widespread, tremendous, easily-accessible supply of free product, it's easy to see what happens to demand.  In this case, however, the legitimate suppliers get cut out of things entirely.  Further, it's not only the pirates for whom the perceived value of the material drops.  Even legitimate consumers, spending so much more than those acquiring the material through infringement, can't help but end up feeling like they're paying too much.

It's the final point above - the perceived value of the product - that is, of course, hardest to measure.  I can't help but feel it's also the most substantial, though.  Everyday, you have new consumers coming of age who may very well have never paid for a movie, song or game and yet watched, listened to, played and even owned countless.  You have individuals entirely unaccustomed to and unwilling to spend money on the creative works of others and who have been conditioned to treat such material as free, rightfully free, deservedly free, and legitimately free.  They demand the intellectual property being produced; they acquire and consume it; they seek it and out appreciate it.  They're entirely unwilling, however, to pay much, if anything, for it.
None! Piracy is good for business!

Let's take students who pirate movies:

  • They can't afford to buy any of your contents.
  • They get bored super fast and need more and more contents
  • They don't value their time yet and they can form bad habits that can be exploited later in their life for profit.
  • They get instant gratification... "I want this movie and I have it now!"
  • They may feel they are doing something naughty. This sensation creates excitement and makes watching a pirate movie more enjoyable. Even a bad movie suddenly tastes better.
  • From time to time, they will feel guilty. "Oh my god this movie is the best movie ever!!! I wish I saw this on the big screen!"
  • They become greedy collectors (they will download more contents then they can even consume...
  • Greed + Guilt + Naughtiness + Excitement + Pleasure!  Your contents is as good as anal sex! After a while they will enjoy it so much that they will tolerate any amount of shit.
  • They compete with fellow pirates... A lot of private torrent sites still have top seeders and top leechers charts...
  • They now have a long-term disorder that tends to get worse without treatment — an addiction.

Students will eventually become professionals and make enough money to join the global competition to become the best consumer ever!

  • They are educated, trained and cultured! They will recognise all the celebs, directors, etc...
  • They believe they have taste or that actually know stuff: "This guy is going to bleed to death if we don't take him to a hospital!!! - Maybe I can help, I am not a doctor but I've watched all of Scrubs, House and Grey's Anatomy.
  • They are still addicts
  • They are also obsessive collectors who will watch every movies, try every game and buy every albums of their favorite bands and artists.
  • Addicts are impatients. If you can deliver their fix faster then the pirates they will buy it from you. (e.g. R5/R9 releases in Russia)
  • They don't even mind that 80-90% of today's contents is garbage because when you have been a pirate the average price you pay for contents is marginal:

GTA V retails for 60$ and you have pirated 1000 games:

The first time you buy an original, your cost is only $ 0.6, after you buy 100 originals, your cost is $ 5.44. You will have to buy a 1000 games for your actual cost to reach the retail price. Isn't that a good way to rationalise an addiction? They won't even mind spending 150$ for a collectors' edition. If you divide the average price of a game by the numbers of hours of entertainment they provide... it's free.

The MPAA should fund sabnzbd, sickbeard, couch potato and headphones and provide free usenet access instead of harrassing honest people.
Stephen Glynn
Stephen Glynn, Have more than 2,000 DVD's, 1,000 Blu rays and have seen too many movies to have a normal life
The only thing I would say to this particular question is look at the history of piracy to see its future.
I.E. Napster - the music industry supposedly losts millions due to Napster but in reality since Napster the music industry has seen massive growth in revenue's, piracy expanded the music that was available, record stores generally only stock "Today's Hits" with "Yesterday's Hits" but Napster made everything available at once. This created new markets for music across the world, for instance, I live in Ireland and would never of heard of Aaron Lweis before Napster as he would not have charted here.

So, if we put that in respect to the film industry, currently IMDB has huge amounts of people who go online and view their ratings, people see a movie and instantly go to whatever torrent site and download, liking the actor they vest time in finding more of that actors movies, as a result the next time that actor has a movie in the theater (In Ireland we just say Cinema) they are more inclined to go and spend money on seeing his/her film, so piracy creates a new market, look at theater income since the explosion of piracy:
The Dark Knight - Billions at the box office
Dark Knight Rises - Billions
The Hobbit - Same
Argo - Huge money

The list goes on......

So in short, piracy creates new markets and extra revenue by broadening the industry so more people will go and watch jOBS, Mr.Kutcher
Garrick Saito
Garrick Saito, likes movies
We will never know is the correct answer, in my opinion.

No offense intended to the asker, but I think there is an incorrect assumption with the premise of the question.

Here is the more practical question.  What is the value of digitally stolen IP?

Whatever that number turns out to be, it is not the same thing as losses that the film industry is experiencing.  The incorrect assumption being made is that someone that has downloaded a copyrighted movie would have purchased it, had they not stolen it.

Let's imagine a 16 year old kid, who has downloaded 5,000 movies.  At, let's say $20 a shot, that's $100,000.  Can anyone say, with a straight face, that kid would have purchased 5,000 movies, if digital downloads were impossible.  I'd say not.

There are, no doubt, losses that the film industry is experiencing.  However, I don't think it is as much as people might think.  I'll be the first to admit, it is a lot.  It's unfortunate.
William Petroff
William Petroff, Web Developer
While I don't think that anyone can deny that the onset of piracy has negatively impacted the movie industry and box-office grosses, I do think that actually putting a dollar value on the losses experienced on the industry is next to impossible.

I, for one, do not put much stock in the numbers thrown out by the MPAA because, as the aggrieved party, I think they may be prone to over-exaggeration, if only to make get their point across. On that point, the Government Accountability Office has looked into these claims and found that the $3 billion in lost revenue the MPAA has claimed it experiences is a figure the MPAA says it got from the Federal Trade Commission, a figure nobody at the FTC has any idea where it came from. (page 23, http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d10...) Additionally the GAO goes on to state that it's hard to judge the quality of most statistical studies that look to find a more narrow range of losses because of the wide variety of assumptions and biases researchers must make and combat while doing these studies (and I'm not talking about the biases on the part of the researcher but rather the bias of the respondent of a survey; some people don't like to tell other people they've done something illegal, even if it's anonymous).

Additionally, while I don't disagree with him often, I must say that I take this particular answer from Nick Huber with a grain of salt as I am naturally suspicious of studies that attempt to draw conclusions based on a single case-study. Also, I refuse to believe that Season of the Witch was really supposed to be a $65 million movie.

Also, if you have read this, but haven't read the discussion going on in Brian Dunlap's comment section, I encourage you to do so. A discussion regarding the idea that the development of the piracy market is merely a natural market reaction to what are perceived as being unacceptably high ticket (or DVD, game, music, etc) prices is a tangent worth going off on.
Bert Cattoor
Bert Cattoor, Value Miner
Your question seems to assume there can only be a loss.

This research paper however finds a slight positive effect: Piracy Impact on the Theatrical Movie Industry

Abstract:
"Piracy of movie products has both a positive impact and a negative impact on the legitimate sales of the movie product. On the one hand, movie piracy decreases the legitimate sales because the pirated movie user may not watch a theatrical movie; on the other hand, however, piracy increases the legitimate sales of the movie product through the impact of network externalities and the diffusion of information. If the positive and negative impacts of piracy on the sales of movie products coexist at the same time, the overall impact of piracy on sales will depend on which impact is superior.
This paper tries to estimate the impact of movie piracy on the theatrical movie industry. In order to do this, a mathematical model was developed by modifying Hui and Png’s model for music piracy and, then, the overall impact of movie piracy on the theatrical movie industry estimate utilizing data on movie sales, admission price, video penetration, piracy rate of movies, and Internet penetration of 25 countries for 5 years through a two-stage least square model analysis. Each positive impact and negative impact of movie piracy on the theatrical movie industry is not estimated, however overall piracy impact resulting from the substitution between the negative and the positive impact of piracy is estimated. The results show that the overall impact of piracy is slightly positive. This implies the counterintuitive conclusion that theatrical movie sales have at least slight benefits from movie piracy."